The story so far...

Artikel
07/11/2007

It's been a busy couple of days for me, but I've had a chance to catch up on the 68 comments responding to my late Friday post. I'd like to call out a couple of comments that made my evening last night when I wrote this – one was where Nick Caraway grants me an honorary MBA, but figures my time in MacBU will be "brief" based on my post. But the prize for most colorful comment has to go to Lucky Lou, who, after smacking me (and all of Microsoft, for that matter) for not offering up information in my post, would like me to "show some nuts for once and err on the side of not being the total wusses you're known to be". He ends by telling me he is rooting for the "overpaid white guy figurehead". Cool – we in the nut-less, wussy, overpaid white guy figure head category hardly ever get rooted for. :-)

On the serious side, one of the themes I found could be summarized as "more transparency, more data". That is the goal of this blog and we are working towards that. While we can't answer every question in real time, we are listening and we are using that feedback to inform our decisions – and we really appreciate the dialog. I know things are relatively quiet on the blog – the team is heads down getting Office 2008 ready to ship. I'm trying to step into the void for the next few months, and things will liven up once the team is out of crunch mode.

The overwhelming request was "EXCHANGE!" We hear you, and we know this is super important to a lot of folks, and it is important to us too – like the rest of Microsoft, we use Exchange here in MacBU. We have been committed to Exchange support since our Entourage X Exchange update over four years ago, and we continue to work with our enterprise customers to set our priorities. We have a number of things planned for Entourage in Office 2008 and beyond that we are excited about and can't wait to share with you when the time is right (yes, I know for a lot of you the right time is right now, but for us, it isn't the right time – yet). Oh, and if you haven't seen it, we have a resource kit that provides guidance for using Office 2004 for Mac with Microsoft Exchange Server, Microsoft Live Communications Server, Microsoft Internet Security and Acceleration Server, and related products.

That's all for now – more later.

Comments

Anonymous
July 11, 2007
Craig, Any chance you folks could spare a couple minutes away from Office 2008 to look into why Messenger crashes on me whenever I close a chat window? I admit that I am using the Safari 3.0.2 Beta for Mac, and the problem started when I started using Safari 3. However, as Messenger is the only software that has had ill-affects from Safari 3, I refuse to uninstall the goodness. I am using Messenger for Mac 6.0.2 (070116). Also, I have sent a crash log after every crash Since early June. To note the importance of this, the program crashes every time I close a chat window. And heck, since I'm posting, I'll add some feature requests for Messenger 2008--1) Tabbed chat windows. 2) Style it so it feels like it belongs on a Mac. 3) Catch up to the Windows version in features.
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
PingBack from http://richardflynn.net/articles/computing-technology/2007/07/12/microsoft-and-transparency-redux/
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
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Anonymous
July 11, 2007
You indicate your understanding that we want more data and more transparency, and then you don't give us any. Then you say that you appreciate the dialog. What dialog? All I see is you guys writing amusing anecdotes about your co-workers and how difficult yet rewarding your work is, while we yell and scream for full Exchange support. That's hardly what I call a dialog. Then, you turn around and say you'll "step into the void" for a couple of months, right after you gush ebullience about more communication, while implying that Office is still several months away from completion and still giving no indication of what'll be in it. Finally, you offer up your current work on Entourage to those clamoring for full Exchange support. If what you already sold was sufficient, then why would we be complaining? We deal with this stuff every day, we know what doesn't work, and no amount of self congratulatory back-patting for all the work you HAVE done will make up for it. Can you see how all of this is not encouraging to us? Can you? Please?
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
First off...I love the idea of this blog! I don't know how long it has been up and running (I just stumbled on it about 2 weeks ago), but I think it de-mystifies Microsoft...people tend to think of MS as the evil giant and Apple as the fanciful spryte frolicking about in fields of daisies, but I think the idea of this blog and the others I've since discovered for Live beta projects are helping 'soften up the image' a bit. So kudos to you and the crew! Also, are there any plans for a Mac version of OneNote? I started using the program awhile back when a Microsoft rep gave me a demo on my college campus and I loved it for years until my Dell died and I switched to my lovely Mac Book Pro. I still use my notes from OneNote but it is only on my PC at home and even since I've been out of school, I think of many times when I would love to have OneNote on my laptop!
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
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Anonymous
July 11, 2007
MacGeek Pro, there were reports of Safari 3 beta on Macs breaking iChat, so it appears Messenger is not alone. I haven't been following along--my 3 Macs create paychecks (mine). So the iChat part of the problem could have been fixed. My Vista machine (cheap laptop) isn't so important--all it does that matters is feed Sony eReader and help answer Vista questions at local computer club. I do have Safari Beta there--having kicked the tires I'll likely remove it and await the real thing. That said--the display of found text is compelling.
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
There is a notebook mode within MS Word 2004. Quite handy. That being said, TELL US WHAT YOU ARE DOING, MICROSOFT! What is your Office progress? When is it going to be released? Screenshots, ANYTHING?
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
Wow, I wasn't with Lucky Lou until this post...now, surprisingly, I am. That was extremely bad form on your part. How can someone ask for feedback and get defensive when it's not all good, or when people express frustration, most of which the MacBU is responsible for? And I'm with the first commenter here as well. We don't want to hear your self-congratulatory stuff. Save that for your internal team. There are far too many deficiencies in Office for Mac (both the 2004 and so far 2008) to be congratulatory in any way or shape, and it sounds like too much brainwashing and marketing to me. If you want an indication of how these things should be handled and how you build a true community around your product, you could learn a lot from small Mac companies like Nisus and Omni. They are responsive, they are nimble, and they really listen to their customers. And people buy their products by choice, not because they feel like they have to. Although I realize there is a scale issue here, this post has just proven that Microsoft (and the MacBU that represents it) still, after all of these years, just doesn't get it.
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
Will the (targeted) release of Office 2008 coincide with the release of Jaguar in October? I'm a product manager myself, so I understand that nothing is for certain when it comes to release dates, but I was curious to know if that's the plan.
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
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Anonymous
July 11, 2007
So, you have no new information? Are you worried that the 1.2M Mac Users Repeat after me: 100% fidelity with Exchange, 100% fidelity with Office 2007 file formats. Thanks.
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
Better Messenger w/ iSight/AV support. Do we really have to wait for that? Is it part of a broader strategy towards mac users from your corpo? It smells like that... lots! So I should not really expect a response from your side.
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
Exchange! EXCHANGE! Please give us an Exchange client we can be proud of, one we can give to our Mac-switcher bosses without having to apologize for the lack of basic features they remember from Outlook, such as storing contact Distribution Lists on the Exchange server. Tom
Anonymous
July 11, 2007
Any integration with MOSS planned? Our company is rolling out MOSS so it would be nice to access it and Exchange easier from the Mac also on my desk.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
The things that are highest on my wish-list right now for Office:

Use the potential of my machine. Esp. when dealing with long presentations or documents (I'm talking many hundreds of pages) word and powerpoint can't keep up with my typing and the machine clearly is spending all it's time in roseta instead of doing something useful. My old powerbook is faster than my new MBP ... only in office now (since adobe released CS3).
Allow me to edit all the animation features of the wintel version of office 2003 (esp moving objects about on a path) in office 2004. I never understood why they editing them got left out.
Any converter to make the clipart that you can download from Microsoft work (all you get now are error messages about the format)
In the future the new XML format will become handy to be supported, but that's still at least months away.

Anonymous
July 12, 2007
Hi Craig, I appreciate it must be hard to know what to respond to and know what to say as you know that if you don't deliver on what you promise there will be a lot of bad press. I look forward to your 'more later' and really hope that that includes answering more of our questions about other products including detail about the must-have full Exchange support. I think that you are spot on about the importance of dialogue between users and the MacBU. I hope you can understand why it is we have a hard time trusting you guys as part of Microsoft. I personally feel that you have a long way to go to build more trust, but really look forward to you working towards 'more transparency, more data'. In this spirit, I'd love some answers about my own feedback:

Your engineers seem to dump files all over the system and don't put them into the right places. Please can you make sure your teams follow Apple's developer guidelines on this more closely (e.g. users have noticed that the Office File Format Converter Beta (Word) doesn't install properly (see Vic's post here: http://blogs.msdn.com/macmojo/archive/2007/05/15/get-converted.aspx) and I personally have seen files like the Office 2004 update logs ending up on my Macintosh HD folder for some reason!
I couldn't agree more with everyone else about the Messenger support and their requests, it is seriously behind and badly needs updating when compared to the Windows version. Would appreciate a word on this.

Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
Hmm, I can't help noticing that the clamouring for full Exchange compatibility is growing by the week/month. At what point will the MS MacBU own up to just how little work to Entourage 2004 is going into the 2008 model? Perhaps we'll be so dazzled by MyDay that we won't notice it's business-as-usual at the back end. Or perhaps MyDay takes up so much screen estate that we won't be able to see Entourage anymore. Out of sight, out of mind. Yes, it's an idiotic post, but without anything else to go on, the mind wanders. To the other business/enterprise users of Entourage: If YOU had an amazing Outlook:mac '08 edition waiting in the wings, would you: a) Keep it under wraps. It's just the first Exchange email client since 2001, after all. No biggie. b) Mention it to a few well-placed rumor sites/tech bloggers in the hope that this will settle the minds of your customers, without giving any commercially sensitive info away. c) Shout it from the rooftops: Because this is what everyone wants! Yeah. Thought so. It's not happening, people.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
It seems there´s a sense of disappointment amongst mac users. As long as I remember Microsoft is a software company so I just cannot understand why it has kept releasing underdeveloped software to a certain community of users. Specially when, if I may say so, this community buys waaaay more original software than win users in percentage. Most of people refer to Exchange but... Office is still not right, it runs real badly under Rosetta on intel macs. I have posted about Messenger already which is more like a "patch" Messenger to hide the disaster the policy of your company is when it comes to develop quality, solid, full-featured software to us. Hope this situation gets solved with your short-term next releases.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
AT LAST Exchange is being viewed as the #1 issue. I find it difficult to understand how so much stress and problems can be created by trying to get two products made by the same company to interact properly. Whatever happens dump WebDav and use the HTTPS delivery mechanism standard found in Outlook 2003 and Exchange. It just works. Entourage's mechanism doesn't. Anything less should be viewed as Microsoft intentionally building an inferior product for a competing OS platform.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
Essentially what you are saying in your posts is that you'll release the next version of Office when you are good and ready and not before---and you don't seem to want to address whether the new version will be any more compatible with the Windows-based version of Office than the old version is now, which is not very. And, you certainly aren't communicating what's happening with Entourage, Exchange, Messenger... To be perfectly honest, I find it ludicrous that I remain a willing customer when you obviously don't care enough to communicate essential information. But, hey, I'm just one guy, you don't need me---and I'm getting pretty good at workarounds.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
Craig, I can appreciate the balancing act... we need to know certain stuff ASAP because it affects our business plans, and you don't feel you can tell us certain stuff..."yet". I think there's an issue of trust that is severely broken. It's pretty clear by reading some of the comments that many don't trust MS. But it's also clear to me that your team doesn't trust us. I worked for about five years on the Windows team. (Windows 2000 and XP) For better or worse, leadership would make public statements about what would be in the upcoming OS. In some cases, those features had to be dropped either because we couldn't get it to work right or it was putting too much of a delay on the schedule. At that point, we had to eat crow and publicly admit we couldn't do what we said we wanted to do. Yet people still appreciated the transparency, and having information as early as possible helped people plan, even if the plans had to change. The risk in telling people your plans in certain areas (especially crucial areas like Exchange that people are begging for) is that they'll get upset if the feature doesn't make it in for even the most valid reasons. But I think that's a risk MS, and your team in particular, needs to take. At this point in your development schedule, way too much is hidden. And I think it goes back to trust. You don't trust your customers enough to say, "This is what we've got planned to ship, but I need to stress that things may change, because..." If things do change, people will be upset. But that's never going to change and since people are already upset, I would hope that you'd choose to have people upset because you're too honest and transparent rather than being upset because you're too secretive and throwing a wrench into their business plans. I don't say this as a slam, but sometimes I wonder if the Mac team suffers from an inferiority complex at MS...that you don't fully appreciate how important your little slice of Microsoft is to people...and that migration planning is a lengthy process that, for some, can't even begin until certain facts are known. Personally, for my company, we're switching to Macs as our primary platform only if Office Mac features are on par with some features we depend on in the Windows Office software. But we can't begin to create an accurate budget because even at this stage (with a shipping window of Fall 2007) we have no clue what to expect or even if Fall 2007 is still realistic. This information affects other purchases that need be carefully planned quarter by quarter. So that's my take on it: We don't trust you, you don't trust us. Unfortunately, I've seen nothing in these recent threads that point to anything changing on either side.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
I want messenger for mac which is better then windows live messenger.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
I don't know why the MacBU is SOOOOOO secretive about features in the upcoming Office 2008 release. It's not like there's any significant competition that might steal them or that revealing them might stall sales of the current version. You've got a pretty captive audience you must admit. Plus, the Windows team was very open about Office 2007 for more than a year before it was released with screenshots, betas and more. Why don't Mac users get the same kind of openness? By the way, Messenger crashes on me, too, when I close a chat. What's up with this?
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
Exchange, Exschmange. I'd love to see more robust support for "Track changes" mode in Word. (I'm sure it's far too late in the dev cycle to do anything specific, but I might as well speak up.) When a 20-30 page Word doc (in Word 2004) gets more than a single user's worth of changes in "Track changes" mode, scrolling and editing gets really slow. After a few rounds, it's just painfully slow -- on a G4, a G5, a Core Duo and even the Quad Xeon Mac Pro. Yet Word on the PC has never had such problems with slowness in revision mode. Still, some praise is due: at least Word 2004 doesn't crash under heavy versioning load like Word v.X did! Word v.X was just crushed by heavy versioning; sometimes I had to take the document to WinWord to get all changes accepted into a final version. Ah, those were the days ;-) Anyway, good luck getting Office '08 out the door. I look forward to it. :-)
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 12, 2007
Like us mac users were not used to secrecy about products, release dates, etc.
Anonymous
July 12, 2007
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Anonymous
July 13, 2007
Thanks for welcoming suggestions for features to include in Office 2008. Compared to most, this is pretty minor, but would be very convenient: to enable "format painter" functionality within Entourage, especially for composing messages. Copying text into an email often results in multiple fonts/colors/etc. Be great to be able to rationalize all that with a format painter button. Thanks.
Anonymous
July 13, 2007
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Anonymous
July 13, 2007
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Anonymous
July 13, 2007
On the topic of Exchange support and Entourage 2008, please make sure it works with Exchange 2000, 2003, 2007 which is 64-bit.
Anonymous
July 13, 2007
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Anonymous
July 14, 2007
Craig Ouch..! There does seem to be a fair amount of pressure built up on the emotional front here....and i can understand why. Its good to see that MS has the ability to allow these views to be heard. On another note my company is about to look at upgrading its Windows Exchange / Office system to the newest version, however the cost is exhorbitant for the meagre new features you really receive. There is a lot of dismay and anger at MS's licensing models and the need to essentially pay for a full version every time you upgrade which is counterintuitive when you are buying anything in bulk and regularly. Where I am going with this is that we are seriously looking at many open source alternatives to all our needs wherever we can and are focusing in on the mail server, office suite issue now. MS has a great opportunity here to move ahead of the Open Source products but seems unable in both Windows and Mac versions to rise to the challenge of building truly superior products (based on guests needs) and communicating effectively what these advantages are. I get the real impression that MS views the Mac as the competitor, what it really needs to understand is that the desktop is increasingly irrelevant and how Office for Mac interacts with all Windows solutions is the real issue. The better it does this, the more advantage it has against Open Source offerings.
Anonymous
July 14, 2007
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Anonymous
July 14, 2007
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Anonymous
July 15, 2007
For the largest development team outside of Apple for the Mac platform I'm impressed it's taking this long to release Office 2008. Adobe was able to release their entire suite plus the Macromedia products before the one product that you guys make. Please stop releasing fixes for Office 2004 and get 2008 out the door!
Anonymous
July 15, 2007
It's easy to overlook two things in the debate:

Apple Computer has significantly delayed the release of OS 10.5. I forget which kitty it is.
Given the history of the three Pirates of the Silicon Valley involved in this (Jobs, Gates and Ballmer), there is no reason to expect that Apple Computer would provide Microsoft with an advance copy of 10.5. We are talking about Pirates, after all.
As impatient as we all are, it would also be silly to expect the MBU to release a product that doesn't work with the next Apple operating system. That being said, this time warp gives the MBU ample opportunity to come up with some Applescripts to use in place of VBA.

Anonymous
July 15, 2007
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Anonymous
July 16, 2007
A little application, tool, menu option, or whatever, to change my domain password (in Active Directory) would be very helpful. Our IT group is reluctant to add my MacBookPro to the domain and Outlook Web Access (where I currently change my password) will be shutdown soon following our conversion to Notes.
Anonymous
July 16, 2007
Craig, Appreciate the blog. It's nice to get an insight into the thoughts of the people making the software. Remember, 70% of vision is just doing what you believe is right and not listening to the periphery. Now, I'm not saying to not listen to your customers, but 500 cooks, does not a good soup make. Hopefully things go well. Cheers,

Jake

Anonymous
July 16, 2007
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Anonymous
July 16, 2007
Though I appreciate the personal response you're giving Craig, here's what I've gathered from the last two posts you've made: You're typing them yourself. That's it. I basically read two posts and the only new piece of information was that your first post wasn't actually posted by you. Wow. I mean, now I can go on living, secure in the knowledge that... I mean seriously. Do you take us for a bunch of snotty-nosed kids that really don't NEED these apps? I'm now concerned that the "second half of 2007" deadline is, well, dead. At least assure us THAT will happen. I guess my point is, if you're not going to give us anything we don't already know, just don't post. It's just not worth it.
Anonymous
July 16, 2007
I would just like to see entourage support the standard cookie based login as used in exchange 2003 and beyond with ISA. If you were not aware, it is completely and utterly unsupported even though a number of simple scripts are available to modify applications to allow cookie based logins. Please, make the simple change here to support the standard mode of operation. Again, VERY simple. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/909268/en-us
Anonymous
July 16, 2007
Well, while everyone bickers and fights back and forth, etc: I just want to jump in and say that I second the above suggestion of intergration with Apple's Address Book! Now that I sync my Blackberry with the Address Book, I haven't even touched the contacts in Entourage and it would be great if MS would offer it as an option as well. I understand the desire to win users over from the Address Book and consolidate everything in Entourage in order to make the program truely indespensible, but we're Mac users after all...syncronization and interoperatability is pretty much everything! As a footnote, I'll again say (as I did towards the top of all these posts...I love this blog and I also love the suspense!!)
Anonymous
July 16, 2007
"– like the rest of Microsoft, we use Exchange here in MacBU." Yes. And when I asked one of your employees recently what he does when he needs to send out a calendar event to a distribution list knowing that A) he will be changing the event time at a future point, B) he will be adding a meeting room as a resource and will expect that the resource mark its free/busy time appropriately, and C) he will be adding at least one person at a later time-- he struggled to come up with a better answer than the one he grudgingly gave me: "I have a PC in my office." If you can't eat your own dogfood, how do you expect us to stomach it?
Anonymous
July 17, 2007
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Anonymous
July 17, 2007
Hey Craig, The Mac crowd is pretty tough sometimes. However, if you deliver, they will love you, although always in a guarded way since you're still MS. If the next doesn't solve world hunger and bring universal peace, well then we'll have to wait for the follow up version. I live in a corporate environment with over 400 PC users and I am the sole Mac user so I'm excited to see what you guys have done to improve Exchange support, PowerPoint performance, and the little irritating things that crop up with cross-platform support. The success of the MacBU is all our success in the corporate space. Make us proud.
Anonymous
July 17, 2007
It's easy to bash Office 2004. Will pose one question the the bashers: In all honesty, can you open Apple Mail and iCal, create a calendar event, e-mail it to people who don't use iCal as their primary PIM divice --or Windows Outlook users -- and have them be able to simply incorporate it into their own calendars? Do the Apple iApps work as harmoniously with contacts, calendars, and mail data as Entourage 2004, with all of its faults? Can Windoze users respond to an appointment invitation? (In my case, Outlook 2003 and 2007 read iCal invitations as separate calendars, not appointment requests) (One tip for Entourage users sending calendar events to Outlook for Windoze users: If you plan to open your calendar event on one of your own Windoze machines, than from your Mac, use a different FROM: e-mail address than the incoming e-mail address you use on your Windoze machine, or it will appear as a text e-mail message and as an appointment request) Bash me all you want: I like Mail better than Entourage but I have to work and live with other computer users. Finally, the use of profanity whether asterisked out or not, contributes nothing to this debate.
Anonymous
July 17, 2007
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Anonymous
July 17, 2007
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Anonymous
July 17, 2007
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Anonymous
July 18, 2007
That would be great. I'd love the irony of company's dumping Exchange Server entirely b/c MS couldn't get their act together and make a real Exchange client for the Mac.
Anonymous
July 18, 2007
I was close to switching from Exchange to Note a couple of years ago but the pain of switching was more than the pain of not switching. Having Exchange is like being married to the Mob. They'll never let you leave. If this release of Entourage doesn't fix things, my 50+ sales people with be making the switch to PC late this year.
Anonymous
July 18, 2007
"If this release of Entourage doesn't fix things, my 50+ sales people with be making the switch to PC late this year." No! Microsoft don't want you to do that! Oh.
Anonymous
July 19, 2007
Exchange shouldn't be in the top 10, it should be number 1. There are tons of other email applications out there that do pop3 and IMAP, the big need for us consumers is a Mac client to the exchange server that is a true MAPI client, not some IMAP-thingy in hiding. Forget the project center, forget fancy to-do lists, throw all that out. If you are honestly listening to Mac customers deliver something that will allow us to no longer be second class citizens in the corporate world. Something we had with OS 9 and that was taken away. Honestly, everything else is meaningless. If you don't prioritize MAPI and true exchange support I don't know how you can look at yourself in the mirror.
Anonymous
July 19, 2007
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Anonymous
July 19, 2007
I think Entourage '08 needs more cross-compatibility with the Windows version. That is, it needs to be able to read backups and exports of all the Windows version's content, be it Mail, Mailboxes, Contacts, Calendars, etc. Seeing how many people have switched from one to the other, it's unfathomable why the two are not better interlinked.
Anonymous
July 19, 2007
How many people are not going to upgrade until a real Exchange client is available? I've got a really large group of Mac users, but they are designers. They rarely use Word, Excel, Powerpoint, etc... but they do need to work with e-mail just like everyone else in my company does. Until we get a real client, MAC BU won't be getting my money.
Anonymous
July 27, 2007
When will Microsoft Publisher and Access make it to Mac OS X? At least a Publisher viewer. Come on guys!
Anonymous
July 27, 2007
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Anonymous
July 30, 2007
Well, If you can't tell us when Office 2008 will ship, can you tell us when we can buy Office 2004 licenses/upgrades that will get a free update to Office 2008? Or if you can't tell us that, what will the policy be? i.e. if you bought Office 2004 3 months before the release of Office 2008, you get a free or just s&h cost upgrade. Thanks in advance
Anonymous
July 31, 2007

Task and notes sync with Exchange server
Distribution lists
Link to google maps in adressbook
Subcribe to iCal publised calendars
Sharepoint integration / Offline Sharepoint reader (Coligo for mac..)
Increased speed when conecting to Exchange server

Anonymous
August 01, 2007
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Anonymous
August 02, 2007
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Anonymous
August 25, 2007
If you could make entourage into Outlook 2001 that would be tops. I would rather not have to use parallels to use outlook to get the full functionality and if entourage was fully compatible with Outlook on exchange server that would be great. I appreciate your efforts to port Office to the mac. I am long time Mac user and Word/Office users.

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